The politically expedient message on high utility rates (blame data centers, blame Trump admin disinvesrment in renewables) is pretty far removed from the truth (blame distribution Capex). What do you think the 26 midterms politics of utility rates is going to look like?
"When asked who they blame for rising power prices, Americans are more likely to say that rising energy demand, their local utility, and their state government are to blame than they are to cite the Trump or Biden administrations.
Americans also blame extreme weather and the oil and gas industry at least somewhat for electricity inflation. Only then do they blame a national political party."
And it's not just a bit: 85% of Dems, GOP & "Independent" blame state gov'ts and utilities. "The renewable energy industry" is blamed by 80% of GOP, 60% of independents and 45% of Dems!!!!!!! Blame to the O&G industry is up there, but I'm afraid they are less likely to feel the blame than renewables and the utilities that have been delivering renewables.
YIKES!!!
Your "investment in CapEx" is reflected in "investments in local grid" which is blamed by 75% of everyone.
The more interesting question, "What do you think should be done..." is apparently not asked.
Can you explain what you mean by distribution cap ex? Are you saying that rate hikes are primarily being caused by utility spending on distribution infra? If so would you mind sharing a source?
I would agree with your assessment in that the truth for why rates are increasing is complicated. This report points to distribution cap ex and rising fuel costs as the source of rising utility costs, as opposed to generation cap ex.
As I understand it, there are three key energy costs related to data centers:
1) increased need for generation sources via increasing peak demand on a grid. This is indirectly paid by large C&I users via demand/capacity charges
2) infrastructure upgrades (i.e. new substations and transformers to interconnect building)
3) volumetric charges (as with all users)
What I'm getting at is that the data center story (i.e. they are increasing rates for all users by increasing demand) doesn't feel completely accurate to me, as data centers a) pay for their own IX costs, b) pay for demand charges which theoretically cover excess generation needs, c) pay volumetric charges, and d) won't even be allowed to interconnect if the utility doesn't think they can do it and still maintain reliability.
You asked: "What do you think the 26 midterms politics of utility rates is going to look like?"
and my answer is: I wonder if rates really are going to become a political problem as widely predicted. They are definitely increasing, and it's not abundantly clear where to lay blame--- but I'm not really hearing much about them. Rent is just such a larger portion of people's budgets than electricity bills. I don't necessarily see this being a major issue in the midterms.
Also, just sharing my general wish for more coverage of short term strategies, technologies, and policies that are actually reducing the cost of electricity. I have had several depressing conversations recently about how heat pumps and EVs are for rich people (the people making that case were not completely wrong), and if the cost of electricity continues to climb these ideas will become even more entrenched. I am as intellectually curious about cool tech innovations that may positively influence the planet in five years as anyone, but it sure would be nice if the cost of electrifying everything wasn't also a barrier in six months.
Love this question, related to this, how do you talk about high utility rates as a democratic political without needing them to have a Phd in the grid (aka be a Volts listener)
I was wondering if it's time for a podcast on working from home. With so many companies now forcing their employees back to the office, with little justification, should we not consider the environmental benefits of not commuting?
When can we get somebody in to talk about the apparent decline in Chinese emissions? Noah Smith just did a post on this and it blew my tiny mind! Also, beer or red wine?
I know the general framework for making cities more climate friendly (complete streets, robust and frequent public transportation, transit oriented development etc) but I’m curious how to take some of that formula elsewhere. Specifically on the heels of summer I’ve been thinking about beach towns. In alot of cases these don’t have great transit or density but have a culture of walking, cute main streets, and are more attuned to nature/environment. Are there any orgs or people who are doing things to make these places part of the YIMBY movement.
The IRS page on Home energy tax credits was last updated on July 2, and still shows solar and battery credits are on through 2032, as passed by the IRA.
July 2 is the day after the Senate passed the One Big Beautiful Bill Act, the day before the House passed the final version, and 2 days before Trump signed the act.
Does the IRS have to follow this page since it has shown incorrect data for nearly 4 months (no, I don't think so).
Why did the IRS update the page as congress was destroying the credits?
Since the IRS had time to update the page before credits were destroyed, why have they not found time to update the page after the changes?
2 weeks ago American Public Media's Marketplace had a story that felt up Dave's alley, i.e. Wyoming shot itself in the foot by supporting the Big Beautiful Bill's reduction of coal mining costs on federal lands; they now face a $50mm budget deficit.
This brought my attention to a potentially useful policy lever: how public land use fees are split up between 1) state and federal governments, and 2) by use case (i.e. coal vs renewables). A colleague mentioned this was an important innovation in the IRA; i.e. states were going to start benefiting financially from renewable energy projects leased on their federal land, IN THEORY making it harder for those legislators to oppose renewable projects on their land.
Q1/ASK: I am hoping to learn more about the topic in general. If folks have any podcasts, articles, subject matter experts, or case studies on the topic you recommend, please share them!
Q2: With the Catalyst Podcast Crew saying that rising energy costs will be key points in some of the elections next year (and Fred/David asking about it in this thread), are folks aware of any races where highlighting that through their BBB vote, legislators voted to not only kill projects that would've helped their rate payers BUT THAT ALSO grew their states' budget deficit? Does this angle even matter, or is it so wonky and convoluted to understand that it'd get lost on the general population?
If people are interested in the UK grid generation mix, I recommend this website: https://grid.iamkate.com/. Lots and lots of green at the moment, due to it being very windy here!
Maybe the most significant recent US development is "Plug-in Backyard, Balcony & NEM Expansion Solar Systems". Two companies are leading this: BrightSaver in California and EcoFlow Stream in Utah. The hardware is made in China, but the concept was developed in Europe. Probably worthy of a Volts interview?
I'm a little bit stuck on this. I've actually considered spending some time in Utah to help people with the DIY of it all. "@BrightSaver" is a youtube channel where they've posted some webinar replays. I've signed up for all their email lists on their BrightSaver.org website, where there are links to a bunch of social accounts on the footer. Today (Wednesday, Sept 17, 2025, at 3 p.m. ET) they have something about an announcement in Vermont. It sounds like the beginning of some campaign. It seems like they've accomplished a lot in a short time.
Something I wonder about is whether Rocky Mountain Power realizes the potential impact of this in Utah. They seem to be open to distributed resources. They have something called the Wattsmart Battery Program which opens customers to enroll in a VPP. So maybe they are relatively enlightened for an IOU?
This backyard balcony plug-in solar is really fascinating. Does anyone have any good videos or tutorials on this? I've seen some info, but there always seems to be links to some part that is completely sold out or is not complete in its info. I'd be super interested in trying to figure out how to do this, even if it's not legal, but also don't want to create some electrical issue in my home. But, the concept seems so simple and straightforward...
Hello Chris. My plans are open-source. Has Panel. Charge controller. Battery. Inverter. In a box. (Picture https://photos.app.goo.gl/CQ5L5hBk9ANdgtNn7) Without the box, Panel has to be mounted somewhere. Wired safely. Electronics has to be protected.
From Brisbane Oz, will send Laser cutting dxf/folding instructions.
I'm not really qualified to give expert advice on electrical safety. If I lived in Utah, I would wire a dedicated outdoor outlet according to code, maybe a 20A circuit for extra safety, but 15A seems fine. Then I would simply get the EcoFlow Stream microinverter and some solar panels. The inverter can deliver 1200 watts, but I'd probably "over-panel" it a little bit. The most informative video on this I've seen so far, is here: https://youtu.be/E_BFfrL80O0?si=SA4vBVlz6mBBBQsN There are bills coming to the Pennsylvania and Vermont legislatures, so far.
I think the Utah law says the utility has to be tolerant of (allow) these systems to backfeed to the grid. There is some concern that some people might have meters that are not able or not configured to properly handle this, and they might be _charged_ for their donation to the grid. I guess one can log on to their Rocky Mountain Power account and figure out whether they're getting charged inappropriately.
Where you do not have the legal support of a law like in Utah, if you backfeed to the grid without an interconnection agreement, you can be penalized. Craftstrom makes products for that situation. I have a basic understanding of their stuff, but I'm not pursuing it, yet.
There is a certain amount of FUD floating around on this subject. FUD, IMO. Like I say, I'm not an expert, but I'd be comfortable doing it, myself.
Solar Rescue. Designed/built. $1100 Solar fridge backup in the event of a blackout. Between blackouts... Float 1kWh a day for a small everyday load. Will give away all plans and instructions. Laser/Bending/Panel/charge control/Battery/Inverter etc.
Hello Chris. My plans are open-source. Has Panel. Charge controller. Battery. Inverter. In a box. (Picture https://photos.app.goo.gl/CQ5L5hBk9ANdgtNn7) Without the box, Panel has to be mounted somewhere. Wired safely. Electronics has to be protected.
From Brisbane Oz, will send Laser cutting dxf/folding instructions.
Thanks for promoting that offshore wind youtube. Lot's more on my mind but it's hard to extract one or two. Hopefully the "Sun Day" message gets out. I'm sure that right wing info universe will find some snippets to mock over and over. "Whaddaya do when it's dark." And probably the mainstream media will find lots of credentialed pro pundits to say realistically we need "all of the above."
I am recently retired and live in Connecticut. I would like to do volunteer work for an organization supporting local energy initiatives or addressing utility costs. I have past experience with 350Ma.org and strongly supportive of our PURA chairman’s efforts in these areas. Thx! Mark B.
#2 is lame - why drop that in when you don't provide any context or reason why the lawsuit was filed? Why not put something in about the merits (if any) and then your thoughts on those.
--- QUESTIONS ---
The politically expedient message on high utility rates (blame data centers, blame Trump admin disinvesrment in renewables) is pretty far removed from the truth (blame distribution Capex). What do you think the 26 midterms politics of utility rates is going to look like?
This should be interesting: https://heatmap.news/politics/heatmap-poll-electricity-prices
I don't know if this is behind a paywall, so:
"When asked who they blame for rising power prices, Americans are more likely to say that rising energy demand, their local utility, and their state government are to blame than they are to cite the Trump or Biden administrations.
Americans also blame extreme weather and the oil and gas industry at least somewhat for electricity inflation. Only then do they blame a national political party."
And it's not just a bit: 85% of Dems, GOP & "Independent" blame state gov'ts and utilities. "The renewable energy industry" is blamed by 80% of GOP, 60% of independents and 45% of Dems!!!!!!! Blame to the O&G industry is up there, but I'm afraid they are less likely to feel the blame than renewables and the utilities that have been delivering renewables.
YIKES!!!
Your "investment in CapEx" is reflected in "investments in local grid" which is blamed by 75% of everyone.
The more interesting question, "What do you think should be done..." is apparently not asked.
Can you explain what you mean by distribution cap ex? Are you saying that rate hikes are primarily being caused by utility spending on distribution infra? If so would you mind sharing a source?
Yes, spending on distribution infrastructure. Look to slides 19-21 of this report from LBNL https://emp.lbl.gov/publications/retail-electricity-price-and-cost
Thank you for sharing.
I would agree with your assessment in that the truth for why rates are increasing is complicated. This report points to distribution cap ex and rising fuel costs as the source of rising utility costs, as opposed to generation cap ex.
As I understand it, there are three key energy costs related to data centers:
1) increased need for generation sources via increasing peak demand on a grid. This is indirectly paid by large C&I users via demand/capacity charges
2) infrastructure upgrades (i.e. new substations and transformers to interconnect building)
3) volumetric charges (as with all users)
What I'm getting at is that the data center story (i.e. they are increasing rates for all users by increasing demand) doesn't feel completely accurate to me, as data centers a) pay for their own IX costs, b) pay for demand charges which theoretically cover excess generation needs, c) pay volumetric charges, and d) won't even be allowed to interconnect if the utility doesn't think they can do it and still maintain reliability.
You asked: "What do you think the 26 midterms politics of utility rates is going to look like?"
and my answer is: I wonder if rates really are going to become a political problem as widely predicted. They are definitely increasing, and it's not abundantly clear where to lay blame--- but I'm not really hearing much about them. Rent is just such a larger portion of people's budgets than electricity bills. I don't necessarily see this being a major issue in the midterms.
Second.
Also, just sharing my general wish for more coverage of short term strategies, technologies, and policies that are actually reducing the cost of electricity. I have had several depressing conversations recently about how heat pumps and EVs are for rich people (the people making that case were not completely wrong), and if the cost of electricity continues to climb these ideas will become even more entrenched. I am as intellectually curious about cool tech innovations that may positively influence the planet in five years as anyone, but it sure would be nice if the cost of electrifying everything wasn't also a barrier in six months.
Love this question, related to this, how do you talk about high utility rates as a democratic political without needing them to have a Phd in the grid (aka be a Volts listener)
I was wondering if it's time for a podcast on working from home. With so many companies now forcing their employees back to the office, with little justification, should we not consider the environmental benefits of not commuting?
When can we get somebody in to talk about the apparent decline in Chinese emissions? Noah Smith just did a post on this and it blew my tiny mind! Also, beer or red wine?
Volts did an interview with Lauri Myllvirta on this last year, but given how fast things are changing maybe Lauri needs to be a repeat guest lol
I know the general framework for making cities more climate friendly (complete streets, robust and frequent public transportation, transit oriented development etc) but I’m curious how to take some of that formula elsewhere. Specifically on the heels of summer I’ve been thinking about beach towns. In alot of cases these don’t have great transit or density but have a culture of walking, cute main streets, and are more attuned to nature/environment. Are there any orgs or people who are doing things to make these places part of the YIMBY movement.
The IRS page on Home energy tax credits was last updated on July 2, and still shows solar and battery credits are on through 2032, as passed by the IRA.
July 2 is the day after the Senate passed the One Big Beautiful Bill Act, the day before the House passed the final version, and 2 days before Trump signed the act.
Does the IRS have to follow this page since it has shown incorrect data for nearly 4 months (no, I don't think so).
Why did the IRS update the page as congress was destroying the credits?
Since the IRS had time to update the page before credits were destroyed, why have they not found time to update the page after the changes?
2 weeks ago American Public Media's Marketplace had a story that felt up Dave's alley, i.e. Wyoming shot itself in the foot by supporting the Big Beautiful Bill's reduction of coal mining costs on federal lands; they now face a $50mm budget deficit.
This brought my attention to a potentially useful policy lever: how public land use fees are split up between 1) state and federal governments, and 2) by use case (i.e. coal vs renewables). A colleague mentioned this was an important innovation in the IRA; i.e. states were going to start benefiting financially from renewable energy projects leased on their federal land, IN THEORY making it harder for those legislators to oppose renewable projects on their land.
Q1/ASK: I am hoping to learn more about the topic in general. If folks have any podcasts, articles, subject matter experts, or case studies on the topic you recommend, please share them!
Q2: With the Catalyst Podcast Crew saying that rising energy costs will be key points in some of the elections next year (and Fred/David asking about it in this thread), are folks aware of any races where highlighting that through their BBB vote, legislators voted to not only kill projects that would've helped their rate payers BUT THAT ALSO grew their states' budget deficit? Does this angle even matter, or is it so wonky and convoluted to understand that it'd get lost on the general population?
Links:
Wyoming Story: https://www.marketplace.org/story/2025/09/16/gop-policy-bill-could-cost-wyoming-50-million-annually
Catalyst: https://www.latitudemedia.com/news/open-circuit-electricity-is-the-new-price-of-eggs/#:~:text=three%20prominent%20statewide%20races
--- CLIMATE EVENTS & MEETUPS ---
Sun Day Celebration in Portland Oregon, September 21, noon to 6pm. Details for an event near you at sunday.earth.
--- EVERYTHING ELSE ---
If people are interested in the UK grid generation mix, I recommend this website: https://grid.iamkate.com/. Lots and lots of green at the moment, due to it being very windy here!
--- SHARE WORK, ASK FOR HELP, FIND COLLABORATORS ---
--- CLIMATE JOBS & OPPORTUNITIES ---
Maybe the most significant recent US development is "Plug-in Backyard, Balcony & NEM Expansion Solar Systems". Two companies are leading this: BrightSaver in California and EcoFlow Stream in Utah. The hardware is made in China, but the concept was developed in Europe. Probably worthy of a Volts interview?
I'm a little bit stuck on this. I've actually considered spending some time in Utah to help people with the DIY of it all. "@BrightSaver" is a youtube channel where they've posted some webinar replays. I've signed up for all their email lists on their BrightSaver.org website, where there are links to a bunch of social accounts on the footer. Today (Wednesday, Sept 17, 2025, at 3 p.m. ET) they have something about an announcement in Vermont. It sounds like the beginning of some campaign. It seems like they've accomplished a lot in a short time.
Something I wonder about is whether Rocky Mountain Power realizes the potential impact of this in Utah. They seem to be open to distributed resources. They have something called the Wattsmart Battery Program which opens customers to enroll in a VPP. So maybe they are relatively enlightened for an IOU?
This backyard balcony plug-in solar is really fascinating. Does anyone have any good videos or tutorials on this? I've seen some info, but there always seems to be links to some part that is completely sold out or is not complete in its info. I'd be super interested in trying to figure out how to do this, even if it's not legal, but also don't want to create some electrical issue in my home. But, the concept seems so simple and straightforward...
A GIF of the box I make. It holds the panel. and contains the electrical. Hope it helps.https://photos.app.goo.gl/XjSTfuZ88yqeQXu87
Hello Chris. My plans are open-source. Has Panel. Charge controller. Battery. Inverter. In a box. (Picture https://photos.app.goo.gl/CQ5L5hBk9ANdgtNn7) Without the box, Panel has to be mounted somewhere. Wired safely. Electronics has to be protected.
From Brisbane Oz, will send Laser cutting dxf/folding instructions.
I'm not really qualified to give expert advice on electrical safety. If I lived in Utah, I would wire a dedicated outdoor outlet according to code, maybe a 20A circuit for extra safety, but 15A seems fine. Then I would simply get the EcoFlow Stream microinverter and some solar panels. The inverter can deliver 1200 watts, but I'd probably "over-panel" it a little bit. The most informative video on this I've seen so far, is here: https://youtu.be/E_BFfrL80O0?si=SA4vBVlz6mBBBQsN There are bills coming to the Pennsylvania and Vermont legislatures, so far.
I think the Utah law says the utility has to be tolerant of (allow) these systems to backfeed to the grid. There is some concern that some people might have meters that are not able or not configured to properly handle this, and they might be _charged_ for their donation to the grid. I guess one can log on to their Rocky Mountain Power account and figure out whether they're getting charged inappropriately.
Where you do not have the legal support of a law like in Utah, if you backfeed to the grid without an interconnection agreement, you can be penalized. Craftstrom makes products for that situation. I have a basic understanding of their stuff, but I'm not pursuing it, yet.
There is a certain amount of FUD floating around on this subject. FUD, IMO. Like I say, I'm not an expert, but I'd be comfortable doing it, myself.
Here's another video that is actually an ad for EcoFlow. The guy is a very slick youtuber, IMO. I don't mean that in a bad way. https://youtu.be/tSnYETHGpIU?si=WQ0ZI60SZv0puZiD
Solar Rescue. Designed/built. $1100 Solar fridge backup in the event of a blackout. Between blackouts... Float 1kWh a day for a small everyday load. Will give away all plans and instructions. Laser/Bending/Panel/charge control/Battery/Inverter etc.
Hello Chris. My plans are open-source. Has Panel. Charge controller. Battery. Inverter. In a box. (Picture https://photos.app.goo.gl/CQ5L5hBk9ANdgtNn7) Without the box, Panel has to be mounted somewhere. Wired safely. Electronics has to be protected.
From Brisbane Oz, will send Laser cutting dxf/folding instructions.
Thanks for promoting that offshore wind youtube. Lot's more on my mind but it's hard to extract one or two. Hopefully the "Sun Day" message gets out. I'm sure that right wing info universe will find some snippets to mock over and over. "Whaddaya do when it's dark." And probably the mainstream media will find lots of credentialed pro pundits to say realistically we need "all of the above."
I am recently retired and live in Connecticut. I would like to do volunteer work for an organization supporting local energy initiatives or addressing utility costs. I have past experience with 350Ma.org and strongly supportive of our PURA chairman’s efforts in these areas. Thx! Mark B.
#2 is lame - why drop that in when you don't provide any context or reason why the lawsuit was filed? Why not put something in about the merits (if any) and then your thoughts on those.
No ?s
Just here to say:
THANK YOU and colleagues ✌️